Who is the Apostate?

The Apostate Being UnIslamicHijabi Kitty

[Updated Below, February 2008]

I’m a Pakistani woman, raised as a Muslim in Saudi Arabia, and an atheist since the age of 17. I am now 24 25 — and fast approaching middle age.

Aging — while not having ‘done enough’ — is one of my obsessions. I’m introspective to a fault (which tells you which category to avoid), and predictably, a depressive. I read voraciously, know several languages, have extremely interesting dreams (another category to avoid), and somehow work through my anxieities without yielding to neurosis.

Islam, naturally, is a huge interest, although now that it doesn’t have much influence on my life, I’m less unhealthily obsessed with it. Religion, politics, feminism, literature, history, art…let’s just say I’m your garden variety humanities major.

By profession, I’m a paralegal for an intellectual property law firm in San Francisco, CA. I will have been in the glorious United States for 4 years on January 24, 2008.

I’m blogging because everyone else is doing it and I’m pissed because I started some five years too late and now I can’t flaunt archives. I kept putting off starting a blog because those years of archives waiting to be filled overwhelmed me. I wanted a blog with archives pre-filled; I’ve now realized that’s not going to happen.

I’m also blogging because “A life unchronicled is a life half-lived” (yes, I made that up). It does not mean that the world will be privy to my every bowel movement and shown my family pictures. It does, however, mean that you will get to hear about how I’ve had sex with every member of my nuclear family (in my dreams). I will decide, on a case by case basis, where I draw the line.

I can be contacted at: alapostate@gmail.com*.

*”theapostate” was taken; so was “apostate.” “Al” is “the” in Arabic, as everyone now knows. Or should know.

Update - February 2008:

This introduction of mine is by far the most frequently read piece of writing on this blog. It’s out of date and a little — okay, very — flippant. And much like reading most of my old writing, my dominant thought is, “This is not meeee.”

You aren’t likely to find who I am from reading this blog, so I won’t even try to amend or add to what’s written above. But take this as a caveat — the intro above is even factually a little out of date.

122 Responses to “Who is the Apostate?”

  1. Nice blog.. don’t feel bad about not having a ton of archives, they will come in time!

    Lol, does your cat like being dressed up?

  2. Hey! What’s all this about? I’ve been discovered already. I thought I would remain hidden for a year, secretly polishing up my rusty writing skills.

    Thanks for being kind about my little blog and thanks for leaving a comment.

    And no, my cat hates being dressed up. I rarely do it, because she suffers so. I just couldn’t resist the hijabi kitty idea though.

  3. Lol, sorry for discovering you! And no worries about your writing skills, I wouldn’t call them rusty by far.

    I guess I found your blog through searching for other blogs that have a similar focus as mine. I haven’t apostated or left the religion, but my actions in the coming months will pretty much label me an apostate.

    Religion is such a sticky pot of honey, isn’t it? Especially when the bees are around.

  4. “Religion is such a sticky pot of honey…”

    It is, that. Partly why I left.

  5. I appreciate your courage.
    Being born in Pakistan and brought up in Saudi Arabia, and becoming an atheist!!!
    You did not write about what made you an atheist.
    I would be interested in knowing how you did it.

    Glad to know one more Atheist coming from Islam.

    Wish you a happy new year and all the best.

    Let us work towards building a religionless society of humans on this earth.

  6. Thanks for your comment, Bala. I’ll blog some time about why I left Islam.

  7. I too am a Pakistani born Muslim turned Atheist. It was the most liberating and healthy thing I’ve ever done! Look forward to reading your blog.

  8. It is rather weird… I am trying to understand, how come so many born-Muslims or Muslims who grew up in strict Muslim cultures leave Islam and the ones comfortable in the West are the converts?

    Most converts to Islam are in the West. Most ex-Muslims are born-Muslims.

    Am I missing something here? It’s an ironic pattern.

  9. Esra’a, my impression is that lots of these Western converts are soon disillusioned with their adopted religion and leave. But that is not as public as their conversion is, for understandable pragmatic and religious reasons, so it doesn’t get catalogued.

    There is also the factor of how much influence religion has on a person’s lifestyle. If religion doesn’t make much difference to you one way or the other, you’re much less likely to leave. That’s why people in Islamic countries who feel the oppression, so to speak, want to leave.

    I myself found that Islam wasn’t held against me in Pakistan once I told people (Muslims) that I wasn’t one: They would immediately stop telling me to quit whoring around.

  10. Well, the Western Muslims that I’ve met take Islam much more seriously than the born-Muslims do. I speak for the Arab world alone, I am not familiar with Muslims in Indonesia, central Africa, Eastern Europe (esp. Bosnia) et al. Most of my friends are atheists, many of whom are Saudi. All of them are young. Some grow out of that mentality, and return to Islam because they claim that they were “young and ignorant” at the time and were confusing culture with religion, and also left their faith due to peer pressure. Others think the “young and stupid” excuse is an ignorant justification for returning to a “brutal faith,” because Islam is what created that culture in the first place and there is no need to confuse the two.

    I say there’s a big deal when people confuse culture and religion. “Islamic” culture doesn’t necessarily stem from religious texts itself. An Imam telling me to shut off my music because it’s forbidden, that’s not Islam. That’s a clowny self-proclaimed ‘Islamic expert’ who is making this seem as if it’s Islam when it’s really not.

    I grew up in a Shia village, as a Sunni. We had a tough time with people at the mosque because they knew we were Sunni and kept claiming that we were “thieves, liars, blind” etc, just because we chose a different path in Islam, but these were ideological and political differences. They didn’t really stem from faith. Our ruling Royal family is Sunni, this is their beef with Sunnis. Not our ideology - but our political culture. People look at this conflict from abroad through foreign eyes and say, “this is your Islam.”

    But it’s not. There’s a lot of things going on that are strictly political but are portrayed as Islam, and that includes sexism too. I grew up feeling empowered by Islam as a woman. I don’t feel weak. I don’t feel hatred for members of any other faith.

    This is a huge debate happening amongst youth. We used to go to coffee shops and talk about politics all day long, now debates center around religion. Many leave. Many foreigners enter. Many are just really confused at whose interpretation to follow. We got Wahabbis running around with their extremism, we got Shiites claiming to be victims of Sunni mistreatment, we got Shiites slaughtering Sunnis in Iraq and vice versa. The Koran justifies none of the above.

    I should remind you that homosexuality is also a huge deal right now in Arab and Muslim countries, and these homosexuals long for acceptance, and with Islam present that is hardly possible. Thus they too have no choice but to leave their faith for the sake of their desired love life. Many won’t officially leave, but will admit that they are mostly Muslim by name. Very few homosexuals are practicing Muslims.

    There is also the factor of how much influence religion has on a person’s lifestyle.

    That is true to a certain extent, let’s consider countries run by Sharia law. In Saudi Arabia, you get Imams and Islamic scholars getting paid to say that certain things go against “Sharia,” even the silliest things like football. So is that Islam limiting people’s lives, or is that the government limiting people’s lives claiming that it’s Islam so that people don’t question it?

    They say Islam doesn’t recognize women’s rights, and they take Arab countries as proof of that. But what about the biggest Muslim nation in the world, Indonesia? They had a female president. I think countries like Afghanistan and Saudi hardly represents Islam in its purity. Their troubles stem from bad leadership, not necessarily Islam.

    In Bahrain we are more liberal. We have 7 churches and a Hindu temple. One of the richest and most successful families in Bahrain is Jewish. My Lebanese brother in law walks around with a chained cross around his neck and he’s yet to be harassed by Muslims. We have Jews and Christians representing our government. There are many Christian missionaries and many of them teach in Catholic schools, which many Muslims also attend. Yet we are an Islamic country, so why do people say we aren’t tolerant?

    I don’t see anyone recognizing these rights that we give to both men and women of different faiths. Yes, of course we are short on these rights (look at Family Law in Sharia courts, women don’t have much rights), so I’m not claiming that we are perfect because politically we are far from it. But religiously? I’d say we’re pretty okay. Sunni vs Shiites, that’s not Islam, that’s politics interfering with Islam. We otherwise have no excuse to dislike or threaten each other.

    The whole point of this is - how many people leave Islam merely due to the politics of Islamic countries, and not the actual faith itself? I come across many Arabs who are like that, but they say they are ex-Muslims as if they disagree with the actual religion. They don’t, they just hated their intellectually sheltered societies. Would you say culture interefered with your decision to leave Islam as well?

    Hmm it seems like this is irrelevant to the actual topic here, should we take this to e-mail or another post or something? I would like to know your views on this.

  11. Esra’a, your comments are very interesting. Would you mind if I copied your essay (or parts of it) into a post with my response?

    I checked out Mideast Youth - so you’re the lurker I’ve been seeing from that site! I’m glad you commented. It’s good to see young people speaking out in the Middle East.

  12. I wouldn’t mind that at all. I’m trying hard to find people to debate, I am forced to put up with either one of the below:

    a) You’re an infidel, praise be to Allah!
    b) You’re a terrorist, and Islam is evil!

    I welcome anything that isn’t one of the above.

    There’s a lot of young people speaking out in the Middle East, my site only collects the sane ones. Israelis, Kurds, Arabs, Iranians, you name ‘em, we got them all! It’s about time Arab youth get engaged in constructive dialogue with fellow Middle Easterners, who are either misrepresented or underrepresented in our media. Thank God for the internet, our alternative media outlet, for making such dialogues possible.

    I look forward to your responses.

  13. Wow! Kudos to all of you with the courage and conviction to leave Islam. It’s not an easy religion to leave and I have the utmost respect for those who do.
    May you live long and prosper!

  14. Being an apostate from a religion that does not like apostates, to put it laughably, is bound to get you a little bit of extra traffic. Many of us are fascinated by people who have such courage at a time when many in government and media seem to be falling over themselves to pander to those who they describe as moderate but could not find the word moderate in a dictionary if their fingers were glued to the word below it.

    You may not be the first Islamic apostate on the Internet but you are still an example to many.

  15. Hello Precious, I was looking to send you a bit of an email but I can’t seem to find an address for you.
    If you would care to, then please use the one with my registration here not the one at the blog, I’m having a spot of bother trying to access it, not an unusual occurrence for me.

  16. Hi. I found your site while googling Islam & Apostasy and just wanted to say hello and thank-you for the candour in which you speak about your life. Keep writing and good luck on your journey.

  17. Amazing…

  18. Don’t feel bad - you did the hardest part - starting a blog. I have thought about it for a long time, and only started one a few weeks ago after I finally figured out that “hey, I can do this and it is pretty easy now.” I am slow and getting started - you certainly are off to a better start than me…

    Looks like you’ve gotten a good start on your archives by now.

  19. I like your blog,

    Your blog styles and your writing stlyle much aprieciable Ok,

    Good bye

  20. How come you’re a paralegal? I can tell from your writing you’d be a good international lawyer or policy analyst. I rarely recommend this to people, but have you thought about law school? I know lots of lawyers with foreign bachelor’s degrees and American JDs. Not all lawyers work in big corporate firms reading documents all day and spending their enormous bonuses on coke.

    Just a thought. Keep up the writing, it’s great.

  21. JT,

    This might answer your question. Thanks for visiting!

  22. Wonderful! Beautiful! It was easy as an atheist to have left the Christian fold, but I am aware it was not always so. A lot of heretics have been punished, even killed in the past - not only for non-belief, but for not believing in exactly the right way. You would be a natural to join the blogswarm against theocracy this weekend. I’m not sure exactly how it works, but I will be writing at least one post myself. For more info, Blog Against Theocracy, or go to Blue Gal’s place and do a search on ‘blog against theocracy.

    BTW, I found you through Mike’s Blog Roundup at Crooks and Liars. The best link I’ve ever found there,and that’s saying a lot. One other thing; YOU ARE DROP DEAD GORGEOUS. Wow!

  23. SadButTrue - I’m blushing. Much too kind, both about the blog and about my looks.

    Thanks. :)

  24. Hahaha. Right now at a chatroom yer hubby often visits, everybody’s checking out your pictures and complimenting you.

  25. hello!

    You know if i’d lived in Saudi Arabia i think i probably would have gone nuts. ( well not that i’m not mad now but still..)
    look forward to reading the rest of your stuff

    cheers
    sonia

  26. U write very well. U believe in using reason and logic. It is , however, difficult to believe that any muslim can quit islam and that too a Pakistani.

  27. Draft Mark Green (D) President 2008

    Who are you voting for in 2008?
    Draft Mark Green (D) President
    An alternative to the usual suspects…

    http://www.frstweb.org/draft_mark_green.htm

  28. U know something i find very interesting about you and most apostates of not just Islam but even christianity n Judaism is the fact that u have an “escape” mentalilty. fair enough i understand if u felt that in Islam and religion in general u feel rather confined and trapped in a “do this or else this”….kind of sphere! ok fair enough but wot i would really appreciate is an indepth analsysis of death and the hereafter beacuse this is the one thing that religion atleast attempts 2 explain if not CORRECTLY and purposefully provides a detailed account of! since we all agree on the FACT that we are all temporary residents in this World i guess the so called “BIG question ” is what comes next after ur apostacy???? please please give an understanble and detailed answer of ur perception regarding this concept! once again i admire ur will of emancipating ur mind from religion but i still disapprove of it unless u prove me otherwise! thanks

  29. ONnOFF looker: I think religious people have an escape mentality — they want an out from the realities of this world, and they escape into the conforting lies of faith.

    I confront reality head-on and see it for what it is — no easy answers for me. No escape.

    I didn’t leave Islam because I felt trapped or confined — I left because it wasn’t true. It didn’t of course help that Islam is very restrictive of a woman’s freedom — that’s a pretty forceful objection against it right there. But I still left because Islam is not true, not because it confined me.

    If religion attempts to explain something, and you have no idea if it’s correct or not, and it certainly doesn’t *sound* correct, what’s the use of this explanation? I want a true explanation, not a made-up one because nothing better is available. I’d rather have no explanation than a silly one.

    What comes next? You mean, after death? I think, what comes after death is what came before life — Nothingness. If you’ve ever been put under general anesthesia — that’s the closest I can come to describing it in humanly intelligible terms. Nothingness. Consciousness ceases to exist with our brains ceasing to operate, and our bodies rot and it’s all over. There’s nothing afterwards.

    Why should there be anything afterwards, if there was nothing beforehand? If you don’t remember being alive before your birth, it doesn’t make sense to think you can be alive after your death.

    Nobody can prove this stuff, but as far as the above explanation goes, science bears me out and science is the best method we have of knowing about the world. As for religion’s explanation? there is not a shred of proof for it, intuitive or otherwise. We know the only reason we believe we’ll survive death is wishful thinking.

    Me, I’m not afraid of extinction. Not existing doesn’t hurt. Hell does. That clinches the matter for me, emotionally, while the above clinches it rationally.

  30. Don’t worry about aging. Middle age is always 10 years more than whatever your current age is.

  31. Hi,

    I googled ‘Pakistani’ & ‘Atheist’ and eventually on page 2 came up with you. I’m pleased as punch to find a like minded pakistani. Not that the Pakistani bit is too important it’s just that it gets a bit lonely sometimes and you wonder if everyone is too crazy to see the truth. Will be following your exploits…..

  32. Hi, which of these 2 theories about Mohammed (and I will not say the “Peace be upon him” garbage. He has given the world no peace.) do you agree with?:

    1. With clear, coherent thinking he recycled other religious texts.

    2. He used an hallucinogenic drug or had a brain disorder that gave him vivid hallucinations.

    If I may add, I recently read a bit of the Koran, and it is painfully obvious that it is man-made jibberish.

    Thank you.

  33. Azra: Welcome! Glad you found me.

    Critical: Neither.

  34. Hey Apostate and you guys, you’re just great!
    Just take a look at her bookshelf: Ayaan Hirsi Ali, Kafka, Richard Feinman’s autobiography..

    You know what, dear Apostate, I praze your parents who brought to this world not just the beautiful girl, but the one of free and and critical mind. I wish you GOOD LUCK and in your case - the sky’s the limit.

    Your Russian atheist admirer.

  35. I found your blog recently via link from another atheist site — it was a pleasant surprise. I am originally from Saudi Arabia and also atheist. I have to say for the longest time I thought I was some kind of a rare abnormality, but now I feel empowered to see other like-minded individuals with similar background. Sadly, for me, I can’t just reveal my identity even though I’m no longer Saudi; I’m considering starting my own blog even though I have poor writing skills (you write wonderfully by the way.) Perhaps I should do it any way!

    I look forward to reading more on your site, I’m book marking it.

  36. apostate,

    Nice blog. Good luck with it. I found you via Adil and his recent work at

    http://kuffar.squarespace.com/

    I will certainly check back from time to time and try to post something worthwhile.

  37. wunderbar

  38. Welcome! We need more young, intelligent atheists. Come visit our blog, too.

    http://www.rational-thought.com

  39. hey you
    a couple of things, quickly. you write well. a suggestion; try and watch this doucmentary called “what teh bleep do we know”. it’s about quantum physics. quite interesting. i know it will interest you. have you read the enw book by richard dawkings about god. it’s nice.
    what do you do you said?
    as for me, well i am writer too. for advertising as of now.

  40. You are just stupid… athiest ehh? well, just one for you, how were you born from just a lil sperm cell?

  41. Mystic- sperm and egg, basically, yes. What about you? Were you the Immaculate Conception?

  42. This is a pretty interesting blog, is it cool if I link to you on my own blog? (I always ask permission just in case)

  43. Nice blog but please be careful since you are now an official apostate of Islam and you of course should now what that means. I am married to an apostate and many Muslims have pretended to be what they are not and would like nothing better than to get rid of my husband. You’re a very pretty young lady with a nice future in the US of A and I wish you all the best. Take care of yourself.

  44. I found your blog through a Topix forum. I thought that I might pass along some of the wisdom of age; I’m 32 years older than you and a lot like you, even though I’m a short, chunky Jewish male (with a sister who once had anorexia).

    Basically: RELAX! Don’t analyze everything, and don’t keep probing yourself. You aren’t anywhere near middle age. I felt the same way when I was 24 and I wish I hadn’t. You learn a lot more if you relax your mind and take it all in. Don’t be in such a hurry to “arrive” at some constructed sense of self. Don’t think of life as slipping away, with lost opportunities that you have to cram in.

    It’s obvious that you’re a person of depth, education, and perceptiveness. In other words, you’re doing better than you think you are, and there’s a lot more to you than you think there is. What you think of as obsession is a hunger to learn and experience.

    I don’t have children, but if I had a daughter, I would want her to be you.

  45. Ernie, thank you for the kind words. I really appreciate it. I seem to intellectually know some of what you say, but emotionally, it’s harder for me to ‘just relax.’ It’s a personality thing, I think: I don’t have a very easygoing nature.

    But as they say, I will ‘try to relax.’ :)

  46. You’re welcome.

    Try meditating — and I mean in a specific way. See if you can find Herbert Benson’s book “The Relaxation Response,” or anything on Clinical Standardized Meditation. It’s non-denominational, very easy (the less effort the better), pleasant, and gradual. It doesn’t promise any religious ecstasy — I’d be very suspicious if it did. No, it’s no more than it says it is — a deeply restful state, not a trance. I recommend Benson because he’s a Harvard cardiologist. He and his colleagues have been studying this since 1967. And have that husband of yours give you a deep massage, squeezing and relaxing those muscles. As my wife never stops asking, what else is a husband good for?

    I’m having a great time exploring your blog. You can think. I was especially impressed that you have a link to the famous essay by Bertrand Russell. Hot damn!

  47. @ The Apostate

    I come from the same country as you. And, I share your lack of religious beliefs.

    I found your blog to be an interesting read. You write well.

    But we disagree on political issues, it seems.

    To be very honest, I didn’t really like your stance on “American evil”. To say that one doesn’t really care about Iraqi suffering, and is instead more concerned about the country which launched a war of aggression against it…really… :P

    There was a time when I associated America with “freedom” and “justice”, much like you do. I actually cheered for them when they invaded Afghanistan, following 9/11.

    But not any more. The illusion is gone. Shattered by Korea, Vietnam, Nicaragua, Iran, Iraq, Chile, Guatemala, Colombia, Congo, Palestine and other Third-world countries. I wonder if they matter as little to you as Iraq and its people.
    The US corporate establishment is not a force for democracy or freedom in the world. It is the exact opposite. And to me, it matters very little what civil liberties it provides to its own citizens, if it denies those liberties to people of other lands, including my own.

    My opposition is not to America’s people, but the system of injustice which its rulers represent.

    Anyway, I digress.

    I don’t believe in any religious system, because they are all contrary to the scientific method.
    But I insist on maintaining my identity as a Muslim…a secular one, but nevertheless, a Muslim.
    I identify with the Muslim people because I belong among them. I was born among them, raised among them, and though I’ve completely abandoned their religious beliefs, I will still identify with their plight, their daily struggles and their emotions.

    I congratulate you for escaping the patriarchal oppression which plagues Pakistani society. You seem to be an intelligent and strong-willed person.

    But at the same time, I wish you would reconsider the new identity that you have chosen.

    If anything in this comment sounds presumptuous, rude or offensive in any way, you have my apologies.

    Wishing you all the best,
    Crimson East

  48. Hi Crimson East: Thanks for your comment, I’m not in the least offended, by the way, but I would like to clarify one point: You seem to have misunderstood my position on Iraq and America — yes, I do care about human suffering. My concern is about equally for the people who are suffering and the destruction of America itself.

    I don’t identify with Muslims because even though I was born among them, they rejected me outright and I have no sympathy for their culture. If I did, I wouldn’t have a problem being a ‘cultural Muslim’ perhaps, but frankly, I don’t see the distinction: To be a cultural Muslim is to be a Muslim, for there is rarely any other kind of Muslim anyway.

    If I feel for people’s suffering, it’s regardless of their religion. America is important to me because it is a grand human experiment which has a better chance of succeeding than anything Muslim societies do — actually has succeeded in many ways. So America going down in conceptual flames is at least as much of a loss to humanity as a whole as the ephemeral suffering of humans — which, though sad, is not going to lead to our self-destruction as a species.

  49. Hello again!

    This is going to be a little long, but I’m bored and I have time, so here we go. :D

    Yes, it appears that I misunderstood your position on Iraq. My mistake.

    Here is something I expected you to say:

    I don’t identify with Muslims because even though I was born among them, they rejected me outright and I have no sympathy for their culture.

    I expected you to say so, from what little I’ve read of your story, the way your family responded to your choices, all that…I can understand where you’re coming from. And for this very reason, no matter how many disagreements we might possibly have, I’ll appreciate the fact that you took a stand against patriarchy, and actually beat it. :)

    Then you say:

    If I did, I wouldn’t have a problem being a ‘cultural Muslim’ perhaps, but frankly, I don’t see the distinction: To be a cultural Muslim is to be a Muslim, for there is rarely any other kind of Muslim anyway.

    Perhaps you are using some rigid definition of a cultural Muslim.

    In my opinion, to be a “cultural Muslim” is simply to be able to fit into a Muslim society, to be able to know how it works, how to interact with Muslim people, etc.

    For me, being a cultural Muslim is about as simple as responding to a salaam, respecting the fact that people around me have religious beliefs, etc etc. You can do this stuff without adopting Muslim religious beliefs.

    Being a cultural Muslim doesn’t necessarily have to be something negative.

    Both of us have lived in Muslim societies, we know a lot about how they work. Muslim societies, just like other societies, are not a monolithic bloc. They are complex, diverse and stratified, just like any other society. And Muslims are not one homogeneous mass, not even within one country.

    My own life hasn’t changed much after I realized that religious beliefs are bullshit. This relization changed the way I think, but that’s all. It had no external effect. I didn’t grow a pair of horns or anything. :)
    I live in much the same way, have the same friends, do the same things, eat the same food, listen to the same music, etc. :P

    Among my friends, I can think of at least five females (right now) who’ve “left Islam”… as in, they no longer believe in its religious teachings. All of them live here in Pakistan. They live as any “liberal” Muslim would.

    And I’d bet that you too might have lived out your life like that, had it not been for the fact that you wanted to marry a non-Muslim man. Am I right?

    Or would you have been one of those…err…activist apostates: the ones who openly declare their religious beliefs (or lack thereof) and then face the consequences? :P

  50. Oh and yes, about your view of America as a great and noble experiment, I used to think so too.

    Surely you know that the US establishment has consistently supported the oppressive regimes in both the Muslim countries that you’ve lived in?

    The Saudi royal family, the Pakistani military (be it Zia-ul-Haq’s Islamism or Musharraf’s secular facade) have been longstanding allies of the US establishment.

    So, how does this tie in with your view of the Great American Experiment? ;)

    And the way I see it, humanity will progress even if the “noble concepts” associated with the American Eagle go down in flames.

  51. And I’d bet that you too might have lived out your life like that, had it not been for the fact that you wanted to marry a non-Muslim man. Am I right?

    No. I left Islam two years before I had any intention of getting married, let alone marrying a non-Muslim. I would certainly never have married a Muslim anyway, because I have a strong prejudice regarding Muslim men (I don’t think they can help being sexist). But my decision to leave Islam, to be an atheist, and to be so openly, was a philosophical one — I find it intellectually unsavory to use a label for myself which denotes beliefs I have no respect for.

    Plus, a lot of ‘liberal Pakistanis’ come from upper middle class or upper class backgrounds. Mine wasn’t like that. A lot of liberal Pakistani families support their daughters’ freedom and respect their choices. My family was conservative and relatively poor. It’s not easy being a liberal Muslim when your parents would regard that as just as much of a departure from the faith as leaving it entirely.

    Not that living like a liberal Muslim was even possible for me: There are limits in Pakistani society on what a woman can do, no matter what her beliefs are. It’s relatively easy to have a ‘modern’ lifestyle if you’re rich and have your parents’ support. If you don’t, you’re pretty much fucked.

    I would, also, have had to perforce move in circles for whose members I have contempt: People who remain ‘Muslim’ but drink and have extra/pre-marital sex. I find such hypocrisy less than charming. I think, if I had to choose, I would prefer the honest-to-God conservative Muslim who is sincere in his/her beliefs rather than the contemptible watered-down Westernized faction of ‘mod’ society, such as what can be found in the National College of Arts, and the ’society ladies’ of Islamabad. I also find it impossible to ‘respect’ other people’s religious beliefs and preposterous labels — I’m rather intolerant, you see, and have no Muslim/Christian/practicing Jewish friends, no matter how liberal they may profess to be.

    Surely you know that the US establishment has consistently supported the oppressive regimes in both the Muslim countries that you’ve lived in?

    I find it difficult to blame anyone but the people of these respective countries for the state they are in. The scapegoating of America is an easy excuse, and everyone conveniently forgets that if it wasn’t the Saudi royal family, it would be the muta’ween, and if it weren’t for Musharaff, the whole country would fall apart, and if Zia-ul-Haq was in power, the Pakistani people wanted him there, since he was such a champion of Islam.

    Yes, U.S. foreign policy sucks and backfires on everyone: It’s clumsy and unjust. But the Great American Experiment, as you call it, is an internal, domestic affair. It has nothing to do with foreign policy. America remains, even now, the best place to live, as far as freedom and opportunities go.

    I just realized you’re male (I just visited your blog) — I’d assumed you were a woman, for some reason. That would explain a lot: It’s much easier to be a man and continue to live as a non-practicing Muslim in a Muslim society, than for a woman. I’m surprised this isn’t obvious to you, but then, my brother never had much sympathy with my difficulties either.

  52. Hi!

    I guess I can accept your arguments (as far as your explanation about not identifying as a “Liberal Muslim” is concerned”).

    And incidentally, the majority of Pakistani people did NOT support Zia-ul-Haq. His policies were an all-out assault on labor rights, womens’ rights, minorities’ rights and basic civil liberties. And it was from organized labor that he faced a major threat, which is why he took steps to dismantle them. To say that the Pakistani people “supported” him contradicts everything we know about that repressive period of our history. It would also be an insult to the millions who suffered from his economic and social policies.

    Anyway, I suppose we’ll disagree on the America issue. For now, I’ll drop it.

    You also said:

    I just realized you’re male (I just visited your blog) — I’d assumed you were a woman, for some reason. That would explain a lot: It’s much easier to be a man and continue to live as a non-practicing Muslim in a Muslim society, than for a woman. I’m surprised this isn’t obvious to you, but then, my brother never had much sympathy with my difficulties either.

    I agree that as a male member of a patriarchal society, I have many privileges denied to women.

    My analysis of your situation was obviously wrong. I assumed that you belonged to the upper-middle-class of Pakistani society. My mistake.

    However, I don’t think you can compare my stance to that of your brother, because I clarified long ago precisely where I stand:
    I support your actions, and would like to see other Pakistani women reach the same level of consciousness as yourself. That is the only way to achieve progress in this country.

    Incidentally, I found your assumption to be quite amusing, and even somewhat flattering. What made you think I was a woman? :)

  53. Crimson East, I actually probably don’t disagree with you very much regarding the U.S. I just want to selfishly keep something positive in my life and the U.S. has been the best place I’ve ever lived and I have a good life here, and I’ve done better than I could’ve done anywhere else. And the Muslim countries I’ve lived in have objectively been worse places to live in, and it’s not all (in anyone’s interpretation of the facts) America’s fault that Muslims are horrible to each other.

    We were both very young at the time of Zia-ul-Haq, and I haven’t lived in Pakistan for any appreciable length of time, so who knows — you may be right, or we both may be partly right.

    Yes, you’re right to be flattered that I took you for a woman. It was the username — I don’t associate ‘Crimson’ with a man, somehow. And it was also the fact that you were here, reading some of my writing and actually taking the time to comment: Taken together with you being Pakistani… I just don’t expect Paki men to be that interested in the thoughts or experiences of a mere woman, you see. :)

    And I know you are supportive of my choices. The comparison with my brother was more in the sense of empathy than support: I was saying you probably didn’t understand. Maybe you do. I should make fewer assumptions, but the truth is, in my mid-twenties, I’m a big curmudgeon and usually automatically suspicious and defensive, especially with ‘desis,’ whom I just don’t trust. Present company excepted, of course.

  54. Hello, yet again!

    I’ll quote you before I reply. I prefer to do things this way…pretending to be more systematic than I really am. :P

    Crimson East, I actually probably don’t disagree with you very much regarding the U.S. I just want to selfishly keep something positive in my life and the U.S. has been the best place I’ve ever lived and I have a good life here, and I’ve done better than I could’ve done anywhere else. And the Muslim countries I’ve lived in have objectively been worse places to live in, and it’s not all (in anyone’s interpretation of the facts) America’s fault that Muslims are horrible to each other.

    Of course.

    We were both very young at the time of Zia-ul-Haq, and I haven’t lived in Pakistan for any appreciable length of time, so who knows — you may be right, or we both may be partly right.

    He died around two weeks after I was born. But I’ve met political activists and others who’ve been through that era.

    Yes, you’re right to be flattered that I took you for a woman. It was the username — I don’t associate ‘Crimson’ with a man, somehow.

    Crimson is the color of flames, defiance, revolt, change, progress and sacrifice. :)

    And it was also the fact that you were here, reading some of my writing and actually taking the time to comment: Taken together with you being Pakistani… I just don’t expect Paki men to be that interested in the thoughts or experiences of a mere woman, you see. :)

    I am interested in the thoughts and experiences of all those who really THINK, be they children, women, men, aliens, whatever.

    And I know you are supportive of my choices. The comparison with my brother was more in the sense of empathy than support: I was saying you probably didn’t understand. Maybe you do.

    I do understand.
    I wish things had been different for you, but given the circumstances you were placed in, it would be misogynistic and very reactionary of me to oppose your choices.
    In fact, even more than your choices themselves, I like the attitude and way-of-thinking which led you to make those choices.

    I should make fewer assumptions, but the truth is, in my mid-twenties, I’m a big curmudgeon and usually automatically suspicious and defensive, especially with ‘desis,’ whom I just don’t trust. Present company excepted, of course.

    Of course you’re correct to be suspicious. I certainly would have, if I’d been in your position.

    Other than that, do try and chill out a bit. :P

    Regards,
    Crimson East

  55. POISONWOOD BIBLE — this is a real eye-opener on US policy, and a great read.

    I am a truly “middle-aged” American woman, with many international friends. After reading “100 years of Solitude” and other works, I’ve become more aware of the unsavory involvement our government has had in many 3rd world countries.

    However, I’ll take life in America any day over life for as a lower-economica citizen in a Muslim, or other male-dominant country.
    Sadly, as individuals, we have limited knowledge or voice in the activities of our government.
    If this were so, the USA would have bombed Bagdad & started this horrid situation in Iran.

    Yes, by 2008 we will get rid of the idiots like Cheney, Wolfowitz & Bush who created one of the biggest messes our country will ever know, but the damage has been done.

    Hopefully, your intelligence and perspectives will enable you to become an involved, engaged, and influencial US citizen that bring a broader perspective to US policy. My hope is that we have more moderate Arab-Americans that can influence our country in positive way.

  56. Although I’m saddened by Crimson East’s evilllee communist tendancies :D…….. I have to agree that from what I’ve heard from the people that did experiace that era the majority of people did resent Zia. I guess he drew power mainly from charging the religious right and ofcourse the army both of whom are by no means representative(or ever has been) of the people of Pakistan even though generally people may have a rather conservative outlook.

    /Taken together with you being Pakistani… I just don’t expect Paki men to be that interested in the thoughts or experiences of a mere woman, you see./

    lol. We’re not all animals!:D

  57. I actauly feel saddened by the fact you left islam , may I ask why you left it ? Im going to go and read your old blog entrys you probably explained it all their .
    I have lots of issues with muslims , especialy scholars the way they explain islam . I can’t see anything lacking in islam except good muslims. whatever your reasons are I would be intrested , I have a friend who is also considering leaving it . ..

  58. Confusedaboutlife, I have an entry called “Why I Left Islam” which is prominently linked to in the sidebar.

    Don’t be sad — I’m very happy I left Islam.

  59. Shalom…

    Great testimonial.May HIS Peace come over you sister.

    GBU

  60. Apostate, you’re gorgeous!

    I came upon this blog via Sarah’s. Hope all is well on your end.

    Don’t be a stanger!

    S

  61. Hey Samosa! You found me! You know I’m the same Paki chick whom you know on facebook, right?

    And thanks! *blush* You are pretty gorgeous yourself.

  62. Why thank you dearest!

    Yes indeed I knew it was you! All it takes it to click your ‘love’s blog’ and voila, the secret is revealed.

    You’re a voracious reader, I should follow your example.

    How goes it? All well?

    xoox
    S

  63. Well, I came across your website searching for people with whom I can cooperate for setting up a website that record all attitudes by non-Muslims towards Islam. So with this message you and your readers will be invited.
    My belief is that what gives Islam this influence and force is not Muslims or Islam’s strength but the rest of humanity’s intellectual and moral weakness and to confront Islam without bloodshed we need to strengthen ourselves morally and intellectual.
    Islam truly is like an illness only the weak are susceptible to it.
    Now, I find out that there is also an admirably brave, beautiful young lady behind intelligent thinking.

    I must also say that I could not understand, how my email address, name, and website address come to be pasted on the form here without me trying to do so.
    I have not been updating my website for years, but most of my articles can be found below:
    http://www.islam-watch.org/SKhurshid/index.html
    If you interested in my project I hope you write to me.

  64. Hi Showan — thanks for your comment. I disagree with you that the west’s moral and intellectual weakness gives Islam strength. I won’t go into the whys, as I’m pressed for time.

    But thank you for your kind words and good luck with your efforts.

    Your email address, name and website address were pasted on the comment form because you came to my site after commenting on some other WordPress blog, where you entered all that information. Your computer saves that information and populates the fields if you are using the same blogging platform as before.

    I hope that made sense. At least, I think that’s how it works.

  65. I wonder why you should disagree. It was not long time ago when the west itself was encouraging Islam and even arming Muslims to confront communists. Does not that indicate clear failure to understand Islam?
    Still most commentators call their own western political systems as capitalism. This indicates undervaluing of liberal democracy. The matter is not just formality. Islam is clearly antithetical to liberal democracy. The misconception of liberal democracy by the Western thinkers and writers has paved the way for the current situation which is characterised by allowing millions of hostile people to occupy the heart of the system and constitute great danger to it.
    These and many other phenomena are symptoms of intellectual and moral weakness. What do you think?

  66. Perhaps, my point about the moral weakness is not clear. By that I mean the incapacity to act resolutely towards Islam. In my opinion Islam should be outlawed. It is a moral failure that this is not being done. Such failure would be similar to not outlawing racism, fascism, sexism and all other malicious belief systems.

  67. Seriously

    I LOL’D

    You’re pretty HOT tho.

    I also feel Sorry for yourself and Future!!

    Because I just read the 1st lines.

  68. i love u
    can u plz add me ???
    fannan_al3rab@hotmail.com

  69. Hi
    See you have caused a bit of a stir with your Hatred of men section.
    If you want a quieter blog I would keep away from that issue as well as babies and religion especially with the amount of certifiable nutters and self interest groups in the US.
    Glad I live in the UK where there is a little more tolerance for individual preference.
    Take Care
    Lawrence

  70. Hello,

    I just want to say that those who leave islam really inspire me. Only the best and bravest of humanity set out on such a road, with an independent smile and in touch with their depths. It’s not like changing from any other religion on earth, I have come to learn, and such persons are often downright heroic. I don’t mean that to sound fancy, I just think it’s true. Kudos.

    BTW, you’re very beautiful, on all levels, and I wish you the best.

    Joseph

  71. Look honey,
    I don’t know what happened to you in Saudia Arbia. Islam is a pretty barbaric and backward religion in my view, but you need to put aside your hate cause it is going to destroy you.

    Joining a religous cult like radical feminism is not the answer to your problems. That’s what feminism is honey a religious cult- a cult that came out of the religous cult called “Marxism.” Marxism destroyed 66 million lives in Russia in the 20 The century–Islam didn’t. So on the broad scale of things, Islam isn’t anywhere near as bad as the religion you’ve joined.

    Get some balance in your perspective, learn how to think critically about all this feminist nonsense. And stop believing everything those bitches say.

    Those bitches are not interested in your best interest or in womens best interest, OK. Get a clue.

  72. Hi,

    Found your blog through a trail of other blogs and stopped by to enjoy. Like the cat too. If you’re a real cat lover check out one of our cats here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/7482843@N06/page9/

    We seem to get attached to cats wherever we go. There’s a couple of pics of dressed up cats in Barcelona in there somewhere. My daughter is about your age - she’s here with some cats in Egypt: http://www.flickr.com/photos/7482843@N06/page2/

    And while we’re talking age, what’s this about you approaching middle age! That means at 54 I’m dead already.

    Well done on your success at leaving Islam. Don’t wish to be patronising, but it appears to be a dangerous move for women in particular, so I admire your courage. I’ve had a pretty easy un-oppressed life so I can only imagine how tough it is.

    Best wishes

  73. You write well. I imagine you put up those photos of yourself on this page - despite your objections to objectification - in a bid to stare down the inevitability of sexist male reflex? Sulaiman rises to the bait.

    One does not - should not - leave or join a religion for its benefits or resultant consequences. A lot of people fail to understand this simple point. One leaves for truth; nothing more, nothing less. One should worship for that and that alone, as well; otherwise, you’re a utilitarian, not a Christian (sorry, “Muslim” doesn’t rhyme quite as well).

    I hope you find your truth. At the very least, find a piece of music you can die to.

  74. Great to hear another very human and positive voice from an Ex-Muslim.
    Lovely Blog!
    Happy new year and all the best.

  75. Well, hello there! I like your blog and I like you. Well, actually I like the way you look based on your picture (IF that is really you). San Fran is on my list of the 4 places on earth I must visit before I die.
    My family comes from the country east of the country that your family comes from and hates so much.
    I hope you stay safe. Takfir in islam is punishable by death. I wouldn’t want something to happen to someone who looks so good in a turquoise top.
    (Since you dropped the ball with crimson’s gender. Yes I have the Y chromosome–not that you couldn’t tell from my post).

  76. Hi, sorry, now my book, “Inside the Mind of a Pakistani Girl,” I got a literary agent interested in it already. I wrote up the synopsis, query letter, and got great feedback, sorry, just thought I better throw that in, too.

  77. I’m sorry to hear you left Islam for Atheism. I took the opposite path. Atheist to Islam(but I haven’t visited Pakistan).

  78. T4K,

    I am sorry to here you left Atheism for Islam.
    You should come over to the Council of ex-Muslims website and explain your reasoning.
    http://councilofexmuslims.com/

    All the best and Hope to hear from you soon.

  79. Good for you!

    I have also recently left Islam.

    Take care :)

  80. Hello, I somehow came across your blog..
    and found it interesting because I’m 17, and a Pakistani born Muslim girl. Recently, I came to the existential crisis, and of course any conflict that uproots the basis of one’s belief or living is agonizing to the very soul. So I was pretty depressed and conflicted for a while. Today I am still a Muslim. I suppose I am TRULY Muslim for the first time, because a faith unexamined is a useless faith. I think it was the realization of my own arrogance. The fact that I thought that I could examine the world and understand it. The elusiveness of humility? What is God after all? Do I believe in some old man in the sky? Of course not. But Islam had never reduced God to such a being, only humans had. God is unlimited. He is the absolute reference point. Not some archaic concept, but an all-encompassing one, an inevitable conclusion to the limitlessness of the universe. I realized that all this time, I had thought outside one box, but inside another one. I am not trying to convince you of anything. Please ignore this if you think that. I don’t really know what I’m trying to say. I guess I just wanted to explain myself to you. From one human to another. I have a lot in common with you. Perhaps we are somewhere inside, the same person. I understand you. I hope you know what I meant, even if you don’t agree. Good luck in your life. Good bye

    ‘By the time’
    ‘Verily all man is in loss’

  81. hi
    I read your thoughts on proporn/antiporn
    I’ve been a Roman Catholic all my life and I’ve been a Charismatic Christian for the past 12 years (I am 43 now with 2 sons, 14 and 5)
    I made many ignorant decisions in my young adulthood, I let what was acceptable by the world’s standard influence me. I did drugs, I had 2 abortions, I lived with men, one night stands, porn, perversions, drunkenness, I separation from my 1st husband then later he died and I was a single mom with a 4 year old… I made my own decisions but without wisdom

    but now my life and mind are transformed, since I was drawn back to the church, a Charismatic church that loved me into the truth. I use the word Love, that is the corn of Christianity. the problem with Christianity like everything is that people are not perfect, even the holiest are still sinners and not God. All people are deceived and make mistakes, no one knows it all. Only God is truly good and wise. His commandments are like safety rules. Like you’d give your child, don’t go in the street you can be hit by a car,… For instance God says…Don’t steal (It’s nice to take what isn’t yours) it’s not right…. all God want for us, His children is good, like eating veggies, but people like junk food. My son’s favorite food is candy, I’d be a bad mom to let him eat what ever he wanted, right? God’s ways lead to Joy, peace, Love…. the worlds ways lead to depression, sickness, anger,….
    I learned this the hard way, I lived it.
    Now on the subject of porn, it is not natural sexuality, porn is perverted sexuality. just as Lust is perverted love. It is a lie, a deception which is accepted by people as the acceptable behavior. It is demeaning of women and men. Like additive things, not good for anyone. It takes the place of the truth, the natural sexuality that God created us with which is a blessing. Humans are designed for relationships, the most fulfilling is in a convent marriage with at it’s core a pure, giving, mutual respecting Love. This is the best environment to raise children in. It is not easily achieved but is possible in the process of trying. Most people at their core are self centered, we are born demanding to be taken care of. It is God’s example to be self giving in Jesus Christ who didn’t die for good people but for all us imperfect, messing up, not so bright, stubborn people who all want their own way. The giving of self as Jesus Christ gave of him self is the heart of the Christian faith. Love is the answer, God is love. Porn is not love. Sexuality without respectful love, giving of self from both the man and women, is a lie and harmful to both. I hope I haven’t bored you, I feel strongly about this because I lived it. I care about you and hope you walk in the truth and healing. God bless you. Love, Janerae

  82. @janerae

    “Only God is truly good and wise. His commandments are like safety rules. “

    Um, what is safe about rules like “stone adulters to death” or “stone disobedient children?”

    Morality comes from people and culture, not from God. The proof is that you don’t actually practice all the rules in the Bible, but, instead, pick and choose the ones that you find reasonable. If God wanted us to obey laws he could. He is all powerful, doncha know. He would not need preachy **men** to tell us His will. And a completely moral god could come up with a better Ten Commandments than the ones in the bible, you know, the ones that don’t prohibit rape, incest, torture, theft, kidnapping or slavery but instead warn us not to swear, pray to idols or covet our neighbors donkey?

    Go apostate, go. Cute cat, BTW.

  83. I am from Pakistan and I am muslim, but I have no issue if anyone wants to leave the faith or not. It is their personal choice, Islam is not about compulsion rather reasoning. If you have found out that Islam is not for you, then no worries, Allah is always there for you, either you accept him or you don’t. if he doesn’t listen to you, then he is not GOD

    Peace

  84. Have a nice day !

  85. i like uuuuuuuu

  86. Man, there sure are a lot of San Francisco and Bay Area bloggers out there.

  87. I shudder whenever I look at my own “About” page. Everything I write wants to morph into something else the moment it’s written.

    Came here because I heard something about some lame ass blogwar going on (I’ve succeed in staying out of these for some time) and I had no idea who this Apostate person was. (Not to worry, I am not now of the notion that I “know” you based on having read your About page and a few blog posts.)

    As for whatever that blogwar thing was about - feh. Just glad to have stumbled in here. You have a punchy and enjoyable writing style which is at odds with the prevailing modality of the polemic, which is refreshing to say the least.

    I will definitely be back.

  88. interesting. we’ve got quite a lot in common, 25, grew up in the gulf, educated abroad, working in law. i grew up a christian though, and am not sure what i am now but am still obsessed with islam since it infuses so much of my life (live in egypt now).

  89. Dear Apostate,

    I shall call you Asma bint Marwan from now on, because you have the courage and gutts to speak what you think about Islam, just like my poetess Asma who stood on her ground and critisize the so-called prophete of islam for his brutal ways against her people, which she paid for her life by his dispicable orders. If this is a prophet sent by God, than I no longer know God.

    I have been an apostate for a long time. I used to be a Moroccan citizen who was born and raised in Algeria (50’s and 60’s). Came to US in early 80’s. Never looked back, visited a lots of countries, and very time my disdain of islam grew bigger and bigger. It is a pack of lies, disdain, mysogyny and backwardness.

    It is a false religion like all the religions. However I must admit that some religions are much better than others because they are never so self-righteous and pretenciouly thinking that they hold the truth as the muslims. I do not own a blog, but I visit and leave comments under various names defending free speech and anyone who criticizes Islam for what it really is.

    Keep up the work and remember the quote from Nelson Mendalla : “We are now free to be Free”.

  90. hey! love your site. kind of random but, do you ever get allergies?

  91. Matt, no.

  92. No offense to any one but i would just like to point out that this website is just a publicity Stunt.
    I mean to attract people there are two pics of this woman, so that everyone comes in and u know share sympathies.

    And please if u ppl are atheists so it be, but atheism doesn’t give u the right to say inappropriate things about others religious beliefs. if u don’t believe in God and His prophets then i request u as a human to at least give some respect to our beliefs.
    Thankyou

  93. Hello,

    I’ve just put you on my RSS reader thingy. I don’t agree with all you say, but your writing is superb and it’s good to see another brown woman on the net (there are some, I know, I read them, but there aren’t enough). My parents are from Bangladesh but I was born in the UK (and raised Catholic).

    I love cats too but they make me sneeze, convulsively, if I have them around me for too long. Which sucks.

  94. i don’t believe all this. there is nothing to strong region 4 doing like this stupid activity. any way but you know and every body know there is a strong and super power in the world. so don’t forgot.

  95. I’m sorry to hear that you left Islam. May Allah bring you back home! Ameen! I am waiting to call you “My sister in Islam”.

  96. To be honest with you…i think your a disgrace to islam…cannot belive that u were once a muslim! and some idiot also blogged that islam is a ‘barbaric religion’…all i have to say to that is ‘GET A LIFE YOU SAD LOSER!’ Islam already has a bad image thanks to the media and people like youself who are willing to leave islam….also wanted to ask…what kind of life do you live without a religion? where are your boundaries? do you have any? how do u discipline youself? and finally…HOW THE HELL DO YOU LEAD YOUR DOOMED LIFE? i feel sorry for any sad idiot related to you in any way..i bet your an outcast in your family too…and now one magical day u feel like you need to share your STUPIDNESS with the rest of the world…:S WTFFF!

    i hope one lonely day in your life u relise what a gigantic mistake you have made…

  97. Crazy religious bigots always seem to suffer from an inability to spell even the simplest of words. Why is that?

  98. I Would just like to comment on the ignorant idiot above^WHAT HAS RELIGION GOT TO DO WITH SPELLING WORDS?

    And btw…i don’t really agree with you on religion..but u hav a lot of courage to stand up for what you think is right!

  99. Like you were; but not now, I am new to this form of communicating and sharing ideas. I salute you, and welcome you to “my house”( I did my graduate studies in religious studies at Berkeley in the Theological Union located north of the main campus on Euclid Ave.), and am presently a special education instructor for students who have specific learning disabilities in the subject are of world cultures/history, In my last teaching assignment I worked with Islamic boys and girls in a charter school structure established in San Diego, CA. Most of the students were from Somalia or Indonesia. There were a couple of students from the Philipines, who were converts to the religion. One or two of the instructors are members of The Islamic Nation.
    I enjoyed reading the responses; but more important I was struck by your humility and genuine charity/piety.
    Peace,
    Tom

  100. While waiting for the next storm to blow across Kansas, I had a chance to read the 99 responses to your site.
    I would like your analysis of the “Nation of Islam( developed in the US during the 1930’s by an activist African -American in Chicago, I think). Do you catigorize it as a”religious sect” of Islam, or as a cultural sect of Islamic teaching?
    peace,
    Tom

  101. Hi Tom - welcome, and I hope you’re staying safe.

    I consider the Nation of Islam to be a small localized sect. I don’t know that I can differentiate between religious and cultural sects in Islam, since religion is culture. The Nation of Islam understandably loses some validity because it is race-based, exclusive and inextricably linked with a uniquely American power struggle.

  102. Thanks alot. I’m curious about the response of the adherents of this sect if and when the call for an “American jihad” should ever occur. Maybe it is here where a dialogue between Eastern and Western followers of the prophet can begin
    Peace,
    Tom

  103. You all seem very articulate.

    One would imagine that if you have such ability to think and analyze things should lead you to conclude that someone has created this ability in you and that it did not just happen all of the sudden. But instead, it lead to your own destruction.

    Fear the wrath of Allah.

  104. I don’t get why you call this blog apostate or still define yourself in a large way by your apostasy if you claim that Islam doesnt really play that large a part in your life anymore..shouldnt you define yourself stronger in terms of your atheism?

  105. Superman, I don’t know how to answer that. “atheist.wordpress.com” was taken?

  106. Obviously I don’t know you, and you can define yourself and this blog as whatever you want, but it seems as though if Islam doest play that large a role in your life, why define yourself through apostasy (ie what Islam considers you)? I shouldnt have said that you should define yourself stronger in terms of your atheism, but rather whatever defines you better than Islam. Am I way off?

  107. Islam doesn’t play that important a role any more, but it has left an indelible mark on me and my apostasy is the cause of some of the biggest life-changing decisions I’ve ever made - such as leaving my family. The consequences of that will always stay with me.

    My current life and the way I approach everything is colored by my apostasy. Even if my apostasy isn’t that big of a deal to me any more, it is to my whole extended family and to my parents, sister and brother. So from the outside looking in, in my culture, my identity IS “apostate.”

    This blog started as an exploration of my life - and the one big identifier I could think of, that lends context, if you will, to me, is “apostate.”

  108. Well said,
    Let’s face it, unless one has had to turn their face from family, home, and culture, understanding of that experience is limited. I can affirm your present outlook; for I too, had a similar experience in my early twenties, but no, I can not compare it to the complete break you went through. But this I can share from my experience; as time goes on if you accept the individual you are becoming, and embrace her completely, you will truely make a mark in the world.
    Peace,
    Tom

  109. 1. The two pictures dont look that similar above, and also its stupidly juvenile to put up a swimsuit photo to provoke muslims. You got boobs, we get it, c cups arent that big, esp. for a desi.

    2. You married a guy who’s like 16 years your senior?!?! talk about lolita. this is why its so hard to take apostates seriously: the most vocal ones have some kind of craziness to them, they go to the far right and become virulently anti-Palestine, anti-Muslim etc. or do some crazy, batty ass junk like marry a dude old enough to be her daddy, but hey maybe saudi made you that nutty.

  110. To the muslim guy above me (because, yes, it’s painfully obvious that you’re a muslim guy):

    So she married a guy who’s 16 years older and that’s “crazy”? How? Explain. I didn’t realize there was an age cap on who a person can marry. Hell, I know there isn’t in islam, what with Mohammed marrying a 6 year old girl and all.

    You’re right about her boobs provoking muslims, though. I’m surprised all the men on here haven’t gone all rape crazy at the sight of a covered tit. Better put that burkha on, Apostate, you don’t want to ignite a riot.

  111. WOW ……..

    O pakistani sister …………… you are the epitome of humanity andthe world will remember that you had the courage to come out the the dogma which is eating away into the Paedophile prophets demnted religious hallucination…..

    You are women whos is praised in our Hindu scrioptures as DEVI ……. living goddess who blesses with her intellectual powers all the PEOPLE in the world……….

    Would like to befriends with you O great woman and learn more about life from you ……………….

    Please be kind enough to bless me ……..

    <My websites are also this : http://www.esnips.com/web/AGEOLDGOLDENHINDUSCRIPTURESANDSTORIES

    I bow down before my Pakistani sister ……… Om shanti

  112. please log on ORKUT AND SEE MY PROFILE IS YOU LIKE

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  113. WORLD IS IGNORING AT ITS OWN PERIL HISTORICAL FACT THAT MUSLIM INVADERS KILLED MORE THAN 100 MILLION HINDUS , JAINS , BUDDHISTS AND SIKHS IN THEIR 1500 YEARS OF INVASION IN THE INDIAN SUBCONTINENT. AND YOUR ANCESTOR WAS ALSO SUBECT TO INHUMAN TREATEMENT .

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    4. TIPU SULTAN - THE ISLAMIC MONSTER OF SOUTHERN INDIA ………… HISTORICAL ACCOUNT

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    MAY ALL PROSPER AND BE HAPPY

    OM SHANTI

    CYBERHINWA@GMAIL.COM
    The Cyber Hindu warrior

  114. I’d like to point out to Jami (post of April 25) that atheist’s comments about various religions are “inappropriate” only in the frame-of-reference of those religionists. To the atheist, they are just observations, fair game, etc.

    It’s all silliness, after all; wish-fulfillment fantasies fleshed out with all sorts of somber pronouncements, rules, customs, for the purpose of holding sway over gullible humans.

    Arguing, among atheists over which religion is worse for something or other is just a stylistic thing. All religions are worse than no religion.

    From a moral-and-ethical perspective, a good action is more moral when it is performed consciously and willfully by a thinking, reasoning atheist, than when that same action is performed by a religionist because some other religionist told him that god blesses the action.

    If your god is omnicient, then nothing that you do is done of free will, therefore nothing that you do has the value of an action performed by an entity who chose that action freely.

    If your god is not omnicient… then what are you doing worshipping it, anyway?

    Religion’s only real benefit to the world is that it provides some pre-packaged recipes for people who are too mentally lazy to think for themselves and work out what is ethical. Discussion about any particular religion or other is merely discussion of flavors.

    I have more respect for the person who comes to a good ethical formula by thinking and inquiring and vigorously paring-away and questioning, versus one who accepts received wisdom and fails to question what comes attached to the “wise” parts.

    I’m not sure but I might have more respect for somebody who comes to a _bad_ ethical formula by thinking and inquiring honestly, than for somebody who just had it handed to them and swallowed it unquestioningly.

    Your ethics are the code of right and wrong, of good and bad that you espouse.
    Your morals are how well you adhere to your ethics.

    Nowhere in there is there need for some mythical superior being who makes its needs and wants known via special select humans who somehow can’t seem to prove that they have received those revelations, nor even that they have gotten right what they claim they have received. The chain-of-evidence is well and truly broken. Argument by assertion sways only the weak of mind (he asserted… :-) )

    With reason, and the scientific method, if there’s some question about how an explanation was derived, you just start over with basic empirical evidence or basic theory and connect the dots. No unexplained or unexplainable leaps are allowed.

    With religion, it all starts out with an unexplained leap.

    So does belief in Santa Claus (or the Djinn or, or, ….)

    I’ve seen nothing to persuade me that fanciful tales about one or another of those entities are any less viable than fantasies about somebody named God or Allah or whatever.

    That is, not only do I find no compelling reason to believe in any of them, I don’t even find any compelling reason to assign a relative hierarchy to the likelihood of their existence. Do you? How so? Saying: “It says so in the Bible/Q’uran” is not an acceptable answer.

    (Catholics like to say “It’s a mystery.” I’m sure there’s an equivalent catch-all Arabic phrase used by Muslim authorities.)

    Cheers,

    - Kevin

  115. I’d like to point out to Cyberhinwa (post July 11) that an all-caps word, here and there, is emphasis, while an entire post of all-caps is considered shouting and rudeness and lacking-in-clueness.

    Not knowing that little bit of netiquette calls into question any claims to Cyber-anything. You should perhaps leave that part out of your name, so as not to imply that you’ve been around cyberspace (outdated term) long enough to have picked up the basic forms.

    Knowing that it’s considered coarse and rude, and just not caring, calls into question your basic good will and reasoning processes - “I’ll deliberately offend those whose opinions I wish to sway.” Hmm.

    Either way, its a bit counter-productive.

    Cheers,

    - Kevin

  116. Just waving hello. Friend of Octo’s, also lived in Saudi for a while as a kid, also now living in the Bay Area.

    I’m not even going to touch on my own conflicted feelings about Islam in public. Suffice it to say that I’d happily spend time in Libya again, but there is nothing in the world that could ever persuade me to live in Saudi as an adult woman. Being there as a teenager was hard enough. I do credit my time there for making absolutely sure that I grew up feminist, though.

  117. [...] blog but I became angry and upset when I clearly saw she had also posted a suggestive picture of herself… Put some clothes on, [...]

  118. Cassandra, thanks for stopping by. Octo mentioned you in passing a month or so ago and I’ve been checking out your blog.

    I totally agree re the Saudi making you a feminist thing - same here. It’s one of the few positive things I got out of growing up there.

  119. I’m so glad you’re here in America, where you obviously belong. You’re a credit to all that’s good about this country. Welcome (Four years overdue, but still . . .).

  120. I was bought up in a muslim culture, im not very religious but i live a healthy and comfortable life. Religion gives you a reason to live. Religion gives you belief, ideas and hope. Without a religion you have nothing to live for. And by the way, i searched in google images for “pakistani randi” (pakistani prostitute) and your picture came up. Thats a feather on your hat!

  121. I don’t know if you go in for the sillier side of blogging, but TAG, YOU’RE IT: http://www.peridotash.com/?p=230

  122. fraz, i know it’s the most obvious question but what the fuck were you (mr/ms. religion) doing searching images of pakistani randis??

    also, can i ask why some “religious” people like you are such assholes? it is incredibly rude to go on some random persons blog and then tell them their pic shows up when you type pakistani whore.

    and stop deluding yourself, you’re definitely extemely religious if you genuinely believe that one does not have anything to live for, other than that.

    how about chocolates? sex? laughs? passion? work? about about life itself? your relationships? yourself? jimmy choos, even?

    apostate, it actually does show up - the first one, in fact. i’m so upset cause i thought it would be ME!

    dammit.

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